tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-85713224217699544.post1674133267496398617..comments2024-03-06T21:06:39.726-05:00Comments on The Coopered Tot: Whistlepig The Boss Hog - A Rye Whiskey Monster Amid A Background Of Deception And Damage Control.NewYorkJoshhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/01236276465833621198noreply@blogger.comBlogger12125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-85713224217699544.post-33544313137738257622014-04-21T04:57:44.242-04:002014-04-21T04:57:44.242-04:00I sure hope those rumors don't turn out to be ...I sure hope those rumors don't turn out to be true. That would be truly short sighted and pound foolish. It does seem clear that WP is pursuing permits to build a distillery on the farm. If they get that project off the ground there will be much more regulatory inspection. Basic building code violations will turn up and be a problem. I hope, for their sake, that they aren't messing around with that. If they are that will speak to both character *and* intelligence.NewYorkJoshhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01236276465833621198noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-85713224217699544.post-71831663006283843672014-04-19T19:38:45.017-04:002014-04-19T19:38:45.017-04:00Bhatka doesn't seem to know how to tell the tr...Bhatka doesn't seem to know how to tell the truth. Besides lying on his label, none of the initial construction he did for the bottling and office facility even had a building permit. He tried to ignore Vermont construction and permitting laws, was going to dump their distillery waste water in the manure pit (which over flows into the river) and rumor has it they installed a bathroom in their bottling/office facility which dumps into the manure pit. He has spent thousands of dollars trying to avoid regulation. He is just a rich jerk who has no regard for anyone but himself.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-85713224217699544.post-85039406682416016652014-03-24T18:33:31.703-04:002014-03-24T18:33:31.703-04:00The "pickle" note is really just an ackn...The "pickle" note is really just an acknowledgement of a touch of acid tartness. You find it in Clynelish Scotch whiskey as well. It's not a big dill pickle flavor - more a bit of tart and vegetal plant kind of flavor. Salt is more of an overtone in whisky - an aromatic - than actual saltiness. Tasting notes are poetic.NewYorkJoshhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01236276465833621198noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-85713224217699544.post-1157788573657231282014-03-24T18:31:47.059-04:002014-03-24T18:31:47.059-04:00Excellent point, tanstaafl2. A WP employee name Z...Excellent point, tanstaafl2. A WP employee name Zach Withers was quoted saying (in a local news piece about how WP's application to build a distillery was being contested by neighboring farmers who feared black mold): <br /><br />"Now whiskey is a product of age. The wood gives it it's flavor," Wither said. "And what makes ours so special is we do about seven years in new oak barrels, then we switch it into barrels that had bourbon in it. It gives it a sweeter finish and makes it a very palatable drink."<br /><br />http://www.vpr.net/news_detail/97881/plan-for-whiskey-business-in-shoreham-draws-scruti/<br /><br />10 years is getting long for rye - and 12 3/4 even longer. I can see the angle of moving to a less aggressively oaking barrel. But barrel management is expensive. I can't imagine WP changing up a successful formula to add an expensive an mostly invisible extra level of management. Ex-bourbon barrels aren't cheap anymore - present supply issues, and all that dumping takes manpower. Unless there were some other ulterior angle with Bourbon...NewYorkJoshhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01236276465833621198noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-85713224217699544.post-78160353684964376602014-03-24T17:25:05.930-04:002014-03-24T17:25:05.930-04:00BTW the bottle of Boss Hog that I bought at retail...BTW the bottle of Boss Hog that I bought at retail (a batch 10 bottle) did not have any real brine or pickle notes that I could perceive. Doesn't mean they weren't there but my palate couldn't find them! I liked it a good deal more than an early 10yo WP I tried SBS although I am still not sure it merits the premium in cost. tanstaafl2https://www.blogger.com/profile/02983632392962001316noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-85713224217699544.post-83339384864913672102014-03-24T17:19:58.063-04:002014-03-24T17:19:58.063-04:00One subject that I haven't seen discussed much...One subject that I haven't seen discussed much is the newer addition to the label that the whiskey is now "finished in Bourbon Barrels" Rather than just being allowed to age for a bit longer did the Boss get put in used barrels for a couple of years of finishing at the "farm" after it arrived in the tanker truck from ADL? Early bottles of WP10 did not make any mention of this "finishing". But now all the WP line says that, including labels on newer bottles of the WP10. I have yet to try a SBS of the older WP10 that makes no mention of this finishing with a newer 10yo that does but in comparing the old WP10 with the current Boss Hog I felt there was some degree of difference that wasn't just from the greater proof. Of course 2+ additional years in any barrel is likely to make a difference! tanstaafl2https://www.blogger.com/profile/02983632392962001316noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-85713224217699544.post-22275731490368077272014-03-22T23:45:46.935-04:002014-03-22T23:45:46.935-04:00Good points, Florin. Although Pendleton's 191...Good points, Florin. Although Pendleton's 1910 tastes quite different, I understand it may be the same source, but via a different production method. Clearly Masterson's Rye and Jefferson's Rye 10 were the same stuff as Whistlepig (although Jefferson's is apparently switching to MGEP/LDI rye now). Whistlepig is not unique - but it has an usually good flavor profile even among those peers (and a higher price tag than any of them too). <br /><br />Your batch variation story is troubling. I've had several and they've all been fine. But I've heard stories of bad bottles from others. The samples of Boss Hog that I've tried are a mixed bag. One I had at the Bottlerocket's tasting (i.e. selected). The other two were random selections from liquor stores. I found them all to be quite similar. <br /><br />Batch variation is not unique to WP, of course. I've had occasional bad bottles even from very good distilleries. For example, I went to a Balcones tasting where the bottle of Rumble was corked and had a musty, slightly bitter, flavor. They put it away and immediately selected a different example. At home, if you hadn't tried it elsewhere, you'd have no idea and probably assume that the product as a whole was bad. Fortunately things like that are rare. NewYorkJoshhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01236276465833621198noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-85713224217699544.post-5203882846034395852014-03-22T23:37:29.719-04:002014-03-22T23:37:29.719-04:00Pickerell's moments of dishonesty on the topic...Pickerell's moments of dishonesty on the topic of WP's origins have been sins of omission: moments where he allowed an implied misconception to stand - not actively voiced an untruth. Thus, I tend to believe when Pickerell says (from the Whisky Advocate piece):<br /> <br />"“It’s fairly common knowledge that that’s where we started,” Pickerell said of ADL. “What’s not common knowledge is that’s not where we are now. We are growing our own rye on site and contracting whiskey from three distilleries in the U.S. and two in Canada.” One of those Canadian distilleries, however, is still ADL."<br /><br />I've heard good things about High West's Double Rye. Shane Helmick's review was glowing. Enough for me to buy a bottle on the strength of it. Thanks for the recommendation. I look forward to cracking it.NewYorkJoshhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01236276465833621198noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-85713224217699544.post-84488279806930499652014-03-22T23:31:48.757-04:002014-03-22T23:31:48.757-04:00This mystifies me as well. Of course it's not...This mystifies me as well. Of course it's not just Canadian distillers. Scotch whisky companies take single malts that could be great if properly matured and blend them into less than interesting younger cheaper blends. But as Oliver Klimek has written, this pays for the niche products, like high end whisky which survives as the icing on cheap whisky's cake. Excellent whiskies are the result of barrel selection as well as careful aging. The barrels that don't make the cut end up in the less interesting offerings such as blends. You can't assume that all the cheaper stuff would have been good stuff if it weren't squandered in cheaper blends. The selection angle is key.NewYorkJoshhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01236276465833621198noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-85713224217699544.post-22250625184712708732014-03-22T19:48:53.760-04:002014-03-22T19:48:53.760-04:00One more thing, on the question of barrel variatio...One more thing, on the question of barrel variation vs. people not knowing their way around a rye. I bought a bottle of regular Whistle Pig some 3 years ago. It was hot and awful and I could not drink it, at any strength and with any amount of time in the glass. I got rid of it. It's impossible that anyone would have awarded this same juice 90+ points. So I'm convinced of the reality of batch variation (same story applies to Jefferson rye, incidentally, as discussed elsewhere by Jordan Deveraux and Michael Kravitz). Moreover, it's my opinion that some producers cherry-pick their barrels/bottles sent for tasting, as opposed to the main market. Did you taste your barrels, #6, 8, 9, in the context of a Whistle Pig tasting, or picked randomly from a shelf of some store (or sent by fellow whisky lovers)? It could make a difference.<br /><br />I for one will not buy another bottle of WP, not as much out of principle, but because I got burned, and I don't like to put down $70 or $120 to play whisky roulette.<br /><br />One more funny thing about the WP guy's statement about his rye being the only aged one, is that in your own comparative tasting, which you did some 2 years ago, you included *four different ryes of comparative age and from the same source*! More came on the market since (Collingwood from a different distillery, Lock Stock & Barrel, others?) So much for the uniqueness of WP....Florinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14445344658258056628noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-85713224217699544.post-64394747465990920542014-03-22T19:34:16.130-04:002014-03-22T19:34:16.130-04:00Josh, the other thing that tipped people off early...Josh, the other thing that tipped people off early on about the origin of Whistle Pig, other than Pickerell's YouTube videos, was the "Made in Canada" statement on the back of the label. That seems to have disappeared.<br /><br />Good point about the young vs. old ryes, I'll add to your list of young tasty ryes High West DoubleRye.<br /><br />It sounds like you're buying the "bombshell" about the five ryes that WP will use for their formulas. That's a very vague statement of intention, rather than of facts, coming from someone with, as you aptly point out, "a background of deception". Why would I start believing him now?Florinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14445344658258056628noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-85713224217699544.post-33649124955532216032014-03-22T18:02:39.462-04:002014-03-22T18:02:39.462-04:00As an Albertan and lover of the entire line of pro...As an Albertan and lover of the entire line of products put out by ADL, it makes me sad to know that the boys in Ogden Park have stocks of apparently phenomenal rye and are cutting them with blander base whiskies to make their standard Alberta Premium and Alberta Springs 10 expressions. It's an unfortunate mold that most Canadian whisky makers are stuck in, that the concept of "straight" whisky has never truly caught on north of the border.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03247043040159619537noreply@blogger.com